HomeMy WebLinkAbout04-03-2023 Park Commission Meeting MinutesMINUTES OF THE
ORONO PARK COMMISSION
April 3, 2023
6:00 o’clock p.m.
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ROLL CALL
The Orono Park Commission met on the above-mentioned date with the following members present:
Chair Brian Roath, Commissioners Janice Berg, Rick Carter, Gordy Stofer, Kjersti Duval, and Cameron
Porter; and alternate commissioner Sandy Rasmussen. Representing Staff was Josh Lemons, Parks
Director.
Chair Roath called the meeting to order at 6:00 p.m., followed by the Pledge of Allegiance.
APPROVAL OF MINUTES
1. FEBRUARY 6, 2023 PARK COMMISSION MEETING MINUTES
Carter moved, Berg seconded, to approve the minutes of the February 6, 2023 Park Commission
meeting as submitted. VOTE: Ayes 7, Nays 0.
PUBLIC COMMENT
None
CHAIRMAN’S REPORT
None
STAFF REPORT
2. GOLF COURSE PARK ENHANCEMENT
Roath said looking at enhancements at the City’s golf course began in early 2022 and is at the point of
needing to make a decision whether to move forward to design or not. The purpose of design is to answer
many of the outstanding questions on costs, aesthetics and noise abatement.
Lemons said the project began with a proposal to add pickleball at the golf course. The Park Commission
conducted a feasibility study. The study showed that site is feasible and the City had limited public
engagement at that point. He said the staff sees two options: move forward into preliminary design which
gives options to continue community engagement and focus on true cost or to remove this Golf Course
Park Enhancement Plan from the City’s CIP (Capital Improvement Plan) goals.
Roath said the park commission had considered the golf course enhancement at the February meeting and
the March workshop meeting and decided to postpone the topic until this meeting in order to understand
the feedback from the community and bring all park commission members up to speed since work on the
proposals had been broken out by committees. From the March meeting there were two takeaways. One
was there were some additional sites that we wanted the time to review. The second thing was the long-
term financial viability of the golf course, and how pickleball and an ice rink and other golf enhancement
projects would contribute to that.
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Porter presented a graph showing the positive and negative points of several possible pickleball sites
including the five identified initially and four more added since the work session. The sites included the
golf course, Casco Rink, Hackberry Park, Fire Station One, the public works site, the Navarre
playground, O.K. Kids, Bederwood Park and working with the school district. Committees looked at each
site in terms of can it support four to six pickleball courts, adequate parking, restrooms, distance to the
nearest homes, whether pickleball can be built without displacing another activity, and the ability to
support traffic flow with minimal disruption to the park.
Duval reported on the Navarre playground located behind the Town Center shops. Currently there are
116 spaces in the parking lot., however there is work planned on the parking lot that could include adding
some islands. There is a sport court and a playground at the site. Duval said it would take quite a bit of
earthwork to level the site to put all the courts in one place and that would also impact the playground, but
they could be built in two sections on the top and bottom of the slope. That would also have the least
impact on the playground, would only take about5 14 parking spaces and would be the same distance to
residences as the existing sport court.
Porter said the next place that came up was Bederwood Park. Bederwood is a lot more open facility but
pickleball courts could not be built without displacing or moving some existing infrastructure. There is a
playground and a ballfield. He said Stofer was taking a look at the schools. They currently do have
pickleball lines painted on the tennis courts out front and they are available when the school is not using
the courts.
Stofer said he and Roach had a conversation with the woman who does the scheduling at the school and
activity center. They have a lot of pickleball programming happening there. A pro is teaching beginner
classes on those four courts and the net height is not ideal for pickleball. But they are getting a lot of use
out of those programs. They seemed receptive to working with us to try to find a joint solution. And we're
working towards having a meeting to further discuss the O.K. Kids site. As long as pickleball is not a
high school sport, they don't have plans today to include those on school grounds. But there does seem to
be possibility for a stronger partnership between the Parks Commission and the school district to try to
find something in this general area.
Porter said the final new site that was brought up was the new public works site. My understanding is that
it'd be very challenging to utilize the grounds there and that just being an active public works site, they
wouldn't allow a lot of access. Based on these findings, my top recommendation is still the golf course.
I've heard a lot of concerns from residents about safety, about noise, about traffic. These are all things that
we would have to look into and mitigate and that would happen during the planning phase. I just had the
opportunity to vacation in in Mexico, where we got to play a lot of pickleball. All five courts were used
every morning for multiple hours by the residents who live in or around this community. They had a
building about 200 feet away that had some space to work. I took my laptop and worked there one day
just trying to understand the noise level and at 200 feet, I was straining to hear the noise of pickleball.
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When we're talking about 600 feet I'm much less concerned. My recommendation is that of all of our
locations in the City it has the least the least uphill climb, in my opinion, as far as a viable site.
Rasmussen asked about the donation garden the site behind the Orono Fire station.
Porter said they did meet with the curator of the donation garden and moving the donation garden is a
non- starter. He said there's raised beds and infrastructure and the shape of the garden and setback
requirements would be very challenging. The site also lacks parking availability.
Rasmussen said in talking with the folks within the pickleball community, they play just about anywhere,.
Give them a flat surface and a net, and they're going to be happy. My interest in the golf course had more
to do with the broader visibility in the community and this opportunity to create more of a center where
people would golf and play pickleball and use the clubhouse. If we were purely looking at it from a
pickleball perspective, I would choose the cheapest site you can find. She said she has been looking at
pickleball sound mitigation. You really want a minimum of 400 feet. Anything less than that is probably
unfair, whether it's one homeowner or a dozen homeowners. She also said she was concerned about the
size of the project and that it should have perhaps been thought of in phases rather than doing the whole
thing at once. If Bederwood or one of those offered a much less expensive alternative. I think that would
actually be my preference at this point. I don't think we're going to do anything this year. I'm under the
belief that it’s probably not feasible for 2023 any longer, so doesn't it fall off the 2023 CIP anyway?
Lemons said the issue isn’t so much timing, as direction. I'm looking for our next step. Is it to move
forward? Or is it to step away from that? Is this the right thing for that location? Are we moving forward
with this or not? For 2023 there's nothing that would happen at any site.
Roath said his concern about Navarre is the proximity to the homes. Using the Bederwood site could
mean displacing another activity.
Berg said she thought the City would have to either get rid of a playground, or a ball field at that site. I'm
a playground person. That's still a very good site because of the parking.?
Porter said that playground is very spread-out and could probably be moved, maybe even closer to one of
the ballfields. That way if you had a sibling playing sports maybe it'd be a nice activity that parents can
watch both.
Lemons said that’s one of the City’s most heavily-used playgrounds. The ball diamond is under-utilized
right now, but it is used.
Rasmussen asked about the cost of earthwork at the golf course compared to other sites.
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Lemons said the earthwork can be expensive at the golf course and probably out of all of the sites would
require the most earthwork. However, the engineers that quoted the project felt what they had quoted was
pretty realistic. Bederwood has a pretty severe slope but also the playground is there, so you do have a
relatively flat footprint. He added baseball is still very popular and the ballfield there is the City’s nicest
and largest ballfield. It's definitely worth keeping. It's a great field. We'd like to see more use of it. It’s
starting to age a little and could use some TLC.
Roath pointed out there's also no irrigation there. The well is now working but it still needs an irrigation
system to be installed for the ballpark side of the field. He said the second open question is the financial
status of the golf course operation. He and the City’s finance director looked at the history of rounds and
revenue at the course in recent years. In 2022 there were 14,000 rounds that generated $382,000.
Expenses totaled $336,000 which means operating cash flow of $46,000 that was used to invest in
drainage work and pond dredging. That was $75,000, so for the year, we ended up with a deficit of cash
flow of $29,000.
Lemons said from 2015 through 2022 we averaged 11,000 rounds a year, with 2018 and 2019 being our
lowest where we were under 7.000 rounds both years.
Roath said the quick estimate is that that golf course is going to be generating about somewhere between
$26,.000 and $35,000 a year in cash flow. Unfortunately, we're in a situation now where there's been
years of deferred maintenance and deferred investment in the golf course. We're facing a ton of capital
expenditures in the near future.
Lemons said the City council has done a great job trying to keep the course current with some major
upgrades the last two years. This year, we purchased a new T mower and rough mower, we've also
purchased a sprayer that we can use at the golf course. Coming up, we do have more needs including a
greens mower, greens roller and sod cutter. The big one is the irrigation replacement. They're going for
about a million dollars for a nine-hole course. At some point, the maintenance shop will need to be
addressed. It's aging and it floods constantly. On the CIP we had the picnic shelter, the lower parking lot,
and firepit. The upper parking lot is happening this year. The clubhouse is an old building. At this point,
really any dollar amount that's invested into it, you have to question is it the right thing? He said kitchen
upgrades came in at $270,000 just to be able to do hot dogs and popcorn. It just wasn't worth it.
Roath said the analysis showed that the City has a business in the golf course that is generating $20,000 to
$30,000 per year in revenue over operating expenses while facing a larger cost to maintain and grow the
business. I guess this is why it matters to this decision. This is one of our prize parks. It's currently being
reserved for a single activity that serves only a relatively few Orono residents. We're not saying that this
needs to make money or needs to even break even. But we are the gap between making money and
covering the expenses which are pretty big here.
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Carter asked about the cost of the irrigation system and whether it is necessary or could be done more
inexpensively.
Lemons said you can go cheap and you will struggle through.
Stofer said the number doesn't surprise him but to add from his experience in the golf world, Orono is not
alone. Many, many clubs all over the country are facing this right now. They're plagued with deferred
maintenance for 40-50 years. And eventually you’ve got to pay up and address some of these issues. Our
golf course here that we love so much is a very unique animal. It's a beautiful, beautiful park and it's an
operating business. So it does require subsidy. Most parks shouldn't make money, and they require capital
investments. We need to be thinking about how do we introduce other ideas to help offset some of these
costs, and we can debate whether pickleball was the right idea or hockey or what but the fact remains
there is potential funding deficiencies in the future that I think we all need to address. If this all does lead
to finding a nice solution for that, I think that's a really great thing. One way is to find more golfers,
which would be great. He suggested generating more rounds in part by adding youth opportunities and
more marketing. He said he and Duval have been discussing the idea of celebrating the course’s
upcoming 100th anniversary by creating an endowment fund for capital improvements at the course
similar to what had been done with the Orono Legacy Fund for Big Island.
Rasmussen suggested for pickleball exploring a fee or membership-based system. If you did a fee-based
plan it would be a great way to limit the number of players to a reasonable number and also maybe bring
in some revenue. I think there's enough demand out there that I you could charge a fee. Westonka charges
$7 to drop in and play. It's different for residents. She noted a fee system also could be used to limit
pickleball hours so that it is not happening during golf league play creating overlapping demand.
Duval said she agrees with that and would be excited to help to think about a fundraising effort and an
endowment. She said she continues to be interested in the possibility of Navarre Town Center and
Bederwood Parks as pickleball sites.
Berg said given the number of people who have contacted here it is clear many in the community want
pickleball. I hope that we can find a way to do that. She suggested increasing fees as the golf course to
increase funding for improvements. We heard a lot of people saying that it needs work; it needs help.
Well, if we find a way to bring money in to enhance the golf course, then possibly it will help us reach the
goal that everybody's looking for.
Rasmussen asked how many people play in the golf leagues and how many are Orono residents.
Lemons totaled 16 for Tuesday night, about 25 on Thursday nights and about 14 for the women’s league
which is growing. He said about 60 percent are non-residents.
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Porter said his concern is making the golf course a destination and increasing its viability, which is why
he recommended that site for pickleball. I love the idea of let's find ways to make it viable. It doesn't have
to be pickleball. We've looked at other sites. He said his rationale is asking would the addition of
pickleball enhance the viability of the golf course. None of us will ever know. If we have other revenues
to ensure the financial stability of the golf course, maybe that one gets pulled off the list.
Stofer said he continues to be interested in looking at a partnership with the school district.
Lemons added he would like to see an updated master plan for the golf course based on input from the
community and the Park Commission. We have one but it's a bit dated; it needs to be refreshed. To try to
prioritize these items and really understand where we're going to be spending money and when at the golf
course, I think is an important effort that we should be looking at this year.
Carter said his first choice would be to separate pickleball and golf and he is not in favor of spending
$20.000 or $30,000, on a preliminary design that he doesn’t believe is going to result in the ultimate
location.
Roath said the analysis of golf course needs had been eye-opening. When residents approached us about
pickleball, in my mind, that was a great match that was a way to address this, and also bring a new
amenity to our residents. I think where we are right now is to vote to move forward with continuing to
design. If this Commission decides that there's a possible way to fund the upcoming needs of the golf
course while adding pickleball to another site, not at the golf course, then I'm open to that idea, as long as
we move quickly towards looking for a Plan B site.
Berg said the City really needs to look at the golf course and concentrate on how to make this a better golf
course so it doesn't go the way of Hollydale and other small courses that have closed.
Rasmussen said she thinks the opportunity to find additional funding for the golf course is a long shot.
What I’d like to suggest is that we keep the golf course as a site that we're considering for pickleball.
We're not doing anything this year anyway, right? We’re not doing anything anywhere else. And in the
absence of a better site, we're coming back here because this is the best site so far. You can't have a small
number of people benefiting from this level of investment; it's got to be something that draws a
significantly larger portion of the community. And we know as the fastest growing sport, there are
hundreds and hundreds of people looking for places to play (pickleball). It has the numbers, it has the
potential to generate revenue, it has the potential to bring golfers there, it has potential bring visibility
there. And investment. I agree that it's off the CIP for this year, but I think it sits equally among the sites
that we're still evaluating. Moving forward with that deliberately in the next 12 months is really
important. We can't just kick the can down the road. This is a huge amount of money.
Stofer agreed it's a big number. But we figured it out for 100 years, and I'm personally optimistic that we
can figure it out heading in the future. He said he was ready to make a motion to remove the Golf Course
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Park Improvement Plan from the current CIP goals, to quickly move forward with the next best site, to
spend the rest of the year formulating a strategy to bolster the financial stability of the golf course via an
endowment fund and to update the master plan.
Roath indicated separate motions would be more appropriate.
Stofer changed his motion to remove the Golf Course Park improvement Plan from the current CIP goals.
After the second Roath called for a vote. Other members of the commission and the public asked for
public comment before the vote. Roath opened the floor to public comments.
TJ Bonnett, 40 Smith and 45 Smith, said he’d love to see historical increases in the value of the land and
multi-year statistics instead of a one-year projection. Cameron, you're comparing a tropical environment
pickleball courts to what's at Orono, which is essentially no trees where sound carries, especially in the
winter with hockey. He cited the number of pickleball courts in the area and said some even come with
professional trainers. Brian, you said that there have been years of deferred maintenance on the golf
course where you're the chair of the park board. What you're saying is like oh, hey, we forgot about this,
but let's do a pickleball court and then we can address our deficiencies that we've had for years. I don't
think we're in favor of a pickleball court in the middle of a wonderful resource like that.
A man who did not identify himself said he was surprised to hear the golf course called a park. It's a golf
course. And it's a shrine in this community. The best part about this meeting was, we talked about the golf
course and how we can enhance the quality of the golf course, which does not have a good reputation
relative to Three Rivers. But people who play it love the golf course. This golf course is an integral part of
the character of this community. You may call it a park; we sure as heck don't want to call it a
playground. We don't have room for pickleball if we want to maintain the character of this place. And the
other thing, I want to commend the commission for the information we got tonight. It was great. You
guys have done a very good job. For the first time, I think we’re understanding what the mission has
been, but we need to share that mission with the community. I know that pickleball is catching on. And
my kids play it and I've played. But it's not part of the heritage of this shrine, which is called the Orono
Public Golf Course.
Kim Carswell, 261 Cygnet, said she would like to propose that we take a step back and up and do a
community survey to understand do we need pickleball? There's so much angst that I see in here. This is a
huge decision. She said the phone calls, petitions, open house and other meetings, haven’t produced a
databased sentiment. If we could do a community survey by a third party, so it's all designed to be
unbiased, we could all be grounded in that. And if you look back from five years, it would feel like you
did the right thing.
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A man who did not identify himself said he is not an Orono resident but was for 25 years and has been on
the golf league for 40 years. He said he would gladly pay $2 more per round if that would cover the
maintenance needs at the golf course. He also supported the idea of a legacy fund for the golf course,
explaining he had been part of something similar in Colorado that was very successful and preserved a
piece of property from development. So I know the money can be raised. And that is a great idea.
Another man said he didn’t think the golf course site was a good choice for pickleball based on the
topography. It doesn't meet any of the demands for putting a flat course and pickleball can be played
anywhere. He suggested cooperating with Long Lake saying the dome located there could be a great
pickleball location.
Janie Delaney said she appreciates all the good information and asked to read a letter from a golf course
neighbor who was unable to attend the meeting. William W. McGuire, 315 Wood Hill Road, wrote in part
that he and his wife and now their two daughters and their husbands and children have lived in the
immediate area for several decades and value many of the characteristics of Orono that distinguish it as a
community. Important to this discussion, we have acted on numerous occasions to preserve and protect
the natural environment and supported the continuation of larger property requirements that limit moves
towards markedly increased density, and the demise of the natural environment. As a result, he said, the
family owns significant acres of land and several houses. We are fortunate to be able to be in that
situation and support the community through significant property tax, and other contributions and actions.
We value what this community is today and are concerned that it remains what we perceive to be
distinguishing and essential elements. I believe the effort to diminish the Orono Golf Course and replace
part of it with pickleball courts and ice rink or other facilities is ill-conceived, short-sighted and damaging
to our community for those living in the immediate area of the property and for all of the community and
area residents and visitors as well. Whether Pickleball is a worthwhile endeavor is not the issue. Are we
willing to push through an action that compromises an already important and long-established community
asset and further to do so in the face of a strong condemnation by area residents to fulfill the reported
desires of a few unnamed parties? Use of another site to pursue all or some of the under-consideration
ideas may have some virtue, but I cannot attest to that at this time. I can be sure however, that alteration
of the Orono Golf Course for this proposal is a bad idea and should be finally abandoned at this time.
Scott Prochnow, 540 Old Crystal Bay Road, thanked the commissioners for their efforts and said he can’t
imagine wanting to volunteer to do that job. I look forward to having pickleball. I object to having it at the
golf course. It just doesn't make sense. The last time I spoke here, I emphasized that you need to focus on
your core business. And I think it's great that you call the golf course a park, but you can't run it as a park;
you've got to run it as a golf course. He said he is a former clubhouse attendant from 2018 to 2021 and
suggested ways to increase the amount of play such as veterans leagues or events, youth leagues and
lessons, patron cards or season passes and increasing weekday play. He noted every sport out there that is
still around was the fastest growing sport at one time. I have said before, focus on your core business.
You need to be competitive because people will run up to Baker or down to Three Rivers or Glen Lake.
which are in much better condition. You're in a real pickle here with needing to upgrade the course. This
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is the first time I've heard that you've recognized it because we've been saying it to Jason, and then Joey
and Josh, for as long as I had worked there.
Harvey Lesser, Maple Grove. You’ve got to come up with some marketing programs to get people out
there. I would personally bring people out there daily, but for what the fee is and what you get out of it for
the short time, it's not an ideal thing for me to bring friends out to. I pay the membership. I'm able to get
my value out of the membership. I just feel that the pickleball court is a bad thing. You need 400 feet
outside of the pickleball court to have freedom on the golf course. On the pickleball court, there should be
good protective netting to protect from golf. There is high maintenance on those nettings. I personally
know the people from Hollydale that ran that and there's upkeep on any fencing you're gonna have to put
up to protect the public.
An unidentified man said Orono Citizens are blessed to be able to play at the private golf courses or the
upscale public courses. You really need to concentrate on bringing people in from outside of the
community to keep that golf course going. You're gonna get some of the Orono residents, especially with
younger children that will come out there once in a while.
Roath closed public comments.
Stofer moved, Carter seconded, to recommend removing the Golf Course Improvement Plan from
the current CIP. VOTE: Ayes 7, Nays 0.
Stofer suggested he could make additional motions. Park commissioners restated the merits of some of
the alternative sites but said they were not ready to select one.
Lemons said unless you have an idea of which location you're looking at, I wouldn't make a motion. He
suggested at the next regular work session having a few sites to discuss as a committee and then prepare
something for the next regular meeting to make a motion to move forward with that. We really would be
starting over.
Roath pointed out the next meeting on May 5 would be a regular meeting and suggested the commission
try to have a recommendation to consider at that point.
Berg said she felt it was owed it to the people that came out to meetings with regards to pickleball and
filled the chamber to look at doing this.
Stofer said he thought the survey was a good idea. Maybe that's something we could look at doing too,
just to try to gather more information.
3. PARKS DEPARTMENT UPDATES
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In further Parks updates Lemons said the City has been planning for an exciting project at Hackberry
Park. The City has asked Bolton and Menk for a quote to do a draft master plan for the park and will
bring the quote to City Council. The house at 140 Hackberry Hill was turned over to the City of Orono.
We'd like to have a draft master plan to the park commission by July 5 and then to have the Park
Commission make a recommendation at the August 7 meeting. That means we could get the master plan
over to City Council for approval on September 25. Once an August timeline is approved by the City
Council, that's our opportunity to really engage with the public on the use of the park. He said the
Hackberry Park subcommittee would be Roach and Stofer.
Stofer said he and Roath have been working on this and have engaged with the five associations that are
active there. Now there's softball, baseball, soccer, flag football, and lacrosse. All these groups are using
it and they all want something out of it. So we're going to try to come up with a plan that makes the most
people as happy as possible. He said a listening session is planned in late April or early May.
Lemons said both Police and Fire will be using the old house for training including a controlled burn and
then demolition. As far as staff reports, he said with the third snowiest winter on record staff has been
busy plowing trails and parks. As mentioned earlier, we've had some great equipment upgrades over this
last two years thanks to the City Council We just got our fertilizer and top dresser for the golf course, and
we’re taking on our own pesticide program at the golf course and all of the parks. He said that staff can
provide a much better program for the City while saving quite a bit of money. A sprayer was purchased
for that and two mowers. Parks is working with the Police Chief on increased security for the parking lot
at Lurton Dog Park as well as enforcing parking passes. Parks is working on hiring for the summer. The
Golf Course Clubhouse manager is doing a great job, he said, and has started a junior league and there are
already 40 kids signed up for the program. She is also taking over management of the women’s league
and has started a mixed league. The target opening for the golf course is the week of the 17th. They will
be implementing a new and very aggressive bent grass that is more drought resistant. Current focus is
transitioning all parks and the golf course for spring.
The Big Island dock repairs have been completed. We have docks going out or closing some of our lake
access points where snowmobiles had access, and done playground inspections and tree work.
SPECIAL COMMITTEE REPORT
None
COMMISSIONERS’ REPORTS
Porter congratulated the Golf Course manager for innovative programming including kids’ birthday
parties.
ADJOURNMENT
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Stofer moved, Porter seconded, to adjourn the Orono Park Commission meeting at 7:33 p.m.
VOTE: Ayes 7, Nays 0.
ATTEST:
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Brian Roath, Chair