HomeMy WebLinkAbout11-19-1984 Planning MinutesPLANNING COMMISSION MEETING
MONDAY, NOVEMBER 19, 1984 7;30 P.M.
1275 BROWN ROAD SOUTH - COUNCIL CHAMBERS
COUNCIL REPRESENTATIVE Ihomas fVahm
SCHEDULED PUBLIC HEARINGS
1. 7:30 p.m. tt877 Richc.rd Perry, 440 h. 450 Willow Drive South
Subdivision of a lot line rearrangement
2. 7:45 p.m.«fci79 Malcolm MacKay, 1145 Sii:th Avenue North -
Preliminary Subdivision
3. 8: ' *0 p.m.«882 Farm at Long Late, Inc., 1765 West Farm Road
Subdivision of a lot line rearrangement
ACTION ITEMS
4. H874 Duane Barth and Mrs D. Johnstone, 1810 Shadywood Fvoad
Variance - Second Review
&«B76 Randy Asplund, 3424 «< 3444 EastlaFe Street -
Variance - Public Hearing
6. «878 Thomas i aul, 19u0 Shoreline Drive -
Request to confirm interpretation of coning code
Public Hearing
7. «B80 Steven Ruce, 4625 West Branch Road -
Conditional Use Permit - Public Hearing
8. «081 William Krutriq, 1629 Bohns Point R--ad
Variance - Public Hearing
9.Fence Ordinance Amendment
ADDITIONAL ITEMS
10. Planning Commission approval of October 22, lV8‘t minutes.
11. Planning Commission to select ropresentative to attend the
December 10, 1984, Council meeting.
ADJOURNMENT
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MIU’JTES op the planning COMMISSIION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 1
ATTENDANCE 7:30 PM The Orono Planning Commission mot on the above date
with the following members present: Chairperson
Goetton, Planning Commission members, Sime,
Rovegno, McDonald, Kelley, and Adams. Planning
Commission member Callahan was absent. Council
Representative Thomas Frahm was present. Building
and Zoning Administator Mabusth, Assistant Zoning
Administrator Gaffron, and Recorder Naab
represented City staff.
1877 RICHARD PERRY
440 6 450 WILLOW DRIVE SOUTH
SUBDIVISION OP A LOT LINE
REARRANGEMENT
PUBLIC HEARING
7:31 - 7:45
Kr. &
were
Mrs. Richard Perry and H.H. f, Ann L. White
present. Gary Phleger was present to
represent the Perrys. Zoning Administrator Mabusth
noted the certificate of mailing and the affidavit
of publication.
Phleger noted that there had been a court case
involving the lot lines and that the Perrys and the
Whites had agreed to agree where the line would be
located and to straighten it and make it parallel
with Willow Drive. This application has been made
as a result of that agreement. There is a fence
that runs along the common boundaries of the Perry
residence and the White residence and a fence that
goes at an angle. Phleger noted that as of today he
had received a final revised drawing and descrip
tion from Mr. Coffin and noted the line had to be
moved slightly because White did not want it at her
gate post. So it was moved slightly to the west to
accomodate her request. If approval is obtained
the Perrys will be taking that fence that now runs
at an angle swinging it to a parallel direction
with the road and matching it up with her gate. We
are not intending to create any new lots or
altering lot sizes or gain so. footage for any
purpose.
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MINUTES OP THE PLANNING COMMISSIION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 2
#877 RICHARD PERRY
Jk
Mnbusth noted that there are no problems with
setbacks for the existing structures. The lot line
changes have absolutely nothing to do with the
setback lines or required building envelopes.
Kelley inquired about the access to the lot and the
width.
White replied that they have a permanent easement
of 20’.
Phleger stated that there will be a 20' easement
which the Vihites have now but for clarification
when the deeds are exchanged it will be again noted
for the record. The easement is across the Perry
property.
Rovegno asked that the plat map be clarified.
Mrs. White said the easement was created because
the Old 87 Road used to run right in front of
Perry's driveway. There i s an aerial view map that
their surveyor,Tom Burquist, found at the court
house that verifies the easement.
Phleger noted that the descriptions, which look
forebodingon the certificate survey, will not
increase the legal descriptions for the properties.
The White property will be described as its present
description excluding anything west of that lot.
Kelley questioned the fill that was going in there
and Mabusth explained that that has already been
reviewed by the city in a previous conditional use
permit review.
Rovegno stated that we have to make sure the White
house maintains road access.
Adams moved, McDonald seconded recommendation of
approval of the Perry/White application of the lot
line rearrangement finding no negative affects on
the existing building envelopes. Approval is
subject to the following conditions;
1. Parcel
homestead .
A is to be combined with White
2. Parcel B is to be combined with Perry
homestead .
Motions, Ayes (6), Nays (0).
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MINUTES OF THE WANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 3
1879 MALCOLM MACKAY
1145 SIXTH AVENUE NORTH
PRELIMINARY SUBDIVISION
PUBLIC HEARING
7:48 - 7:57 John Taylor represented Mai com MacKay. Assistant
Zoning Administrator Gaffron noted the certificate
of mailing and the affidavit of publication* There
was no one present from the public.
Taylor stated this a matter of subdividing an 18
acre parcel for tax purposes into one 12 acre
parcel and one 7 acre parcel and having the 12 acre
parcel adjoining the property which would lead to
potential sale.
Gaffron noted he had received the septic testing
report for the existing house on Parcel A and there
is adequate room for future septic needs if
existing system fails. There are some wetlands
shown on the plat maps, leaving on Parcel A, 5.6
dry acres and Parcel B, 4.4 dry acres. There is an
easement of 50' width for private roadway. There
is a road that serves the MacKay house and two
houses to the west of it.
Adams questioned the possible rearrangements and
subdivision/variances that might be brought up in
the future because of the size of the parcels.
Adams further stated thi'*; he assumed that the
ultimate plan must be to combine the two parcels
and then further subdivide the property.
Taylor stated ho was unaware of any future plan.
Rovegno asked Gaffron if a Flowage and Conservation
Easement was needed for the wetlands.
Gaffron stated that they are wetlands and so we
should take a Conservation and Flowage Easement now
at the time of subdivision. The wetlands were
added in at the last minute by the surveyor. On
the original survey the lakeshore was shown closer
to the house, which has been determined incorrect.
Kelley clarified to Taylor what is needed. Asking
for a Conservation and Flowage Easement means the
surveyor will have to describe the boundaries of
the wetlands. The applicant would be responsible
for the legal description.
MINUTES OP THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 4
V879 MALCOLM MACKAY Kelley moved, Simc seconded to reconur'end approval
of #879 Malcolm MacKay, preliminary subdivision
subject to the following conditions:
1. Conservation & Flowage Easement
2. Payment of $100.00 park fee
Motion, Ayes (6), Nays (0).
1882 FARM AT LONG LAKE, INC.,
1765 WEST FARM ROAD
SUBDIVISION OP A IX)T LINE
REARRANGEMENT
PUBLIC HEARING
8:08 - 8:12
Tim Adams was present. Zoning Administrator
Mabusth noted the certificate of mailing and the
affida'/it of publication. There was no one present
for the public hearing.
Mabusth explained that the division involves a
buildable lot in the Farm at Long Lake plat. The
lot had specific limitations; a view easement over
it, and the topography. Mabusth sees no problem
with the proposal as each affected building
envelope will be improved.
Mabusth stated that Parcel C will retain riparian
rights, the other two lots will not.
Rovegno moved, Sime seconded, to recommend the
approval of the Farm at Long Lake Inc.'s
application of a lot line rearrangement finding the
building envelopes of each affected property to be
improved subject to the following conditions:
1. Parcel A to be combined with Lot 17, Block 1
2. Parcel B to be combined with Lot 15, Block 1
3. Parcel C to be combined with Tract G, RLS 1275
4. Combined Tract G shall have riparian access to
Long Lake combined Lots 15 and 17 are not riparian
to Long Lake
Motion, Ayes (6), Nays (0).
MINUTES OP THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 5
1874 DUANE BARTH i MRS. JOHNSTONE
1810 SHADYNOOD ROAD
VARIANCE - SECOND REVIEW
Duane Barth was present. Assistant Zoning
Administrator Gaffron noted the certificate of
mailing and the affidavit of publication. The
following neighbors were present:
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Charles Pyle of 1820 Shadywood Road
Dave and Holly Eiss of 1790 Shadywood Road
Gaffron stated that this application had been
tabled at the October meeting pending submittal of
a number of items, one of them being the applicants
hardcover development proposal which is explained
on Exhibit E.
Barth explained for Lot 21 the applicant proposes a
75-250' hardcover of 22.7% using a porous paving
block driveway "grass pavers" which would eliminate
some of the hardcover problem. They are 80% open
on the top - we used 50% open in our calculation.
They are also set in sand 6 - 8" so all the water
goes through them. Sidewalks and decks are not
shown on the proposal. The existing garage would
be removed.
Barth further noted for Lot 22, with the existing
house, a proposed addition and a porous pavement
driveway (to be consistent), without decks or
sidwalks, the hardcover is 16.4%.
Gaffron's comments included a necessity to regulate
in the future the possible pavement of driveway on
Lot 21 and since we don't require a permit for
paving a driveway, how do we regulate it?
Gaffron went on to comment on the assessment
record. The vaccint lot has not been taxed at a
lower value, than the lot with the house, hence it
does not appear to have been considered as
accessory property to the lot with the house. In
fact, the land valuations have been almost equal
through-out the research period.
Gaffron explained Exhibit F, Plat Map of neighbor
hood existing development. It is from Coffee
Bridge to the intersection of 51 on the east side
of Hwy 19. Lot sizes are quite variable from .22
to 1 acre with house. Lot 21 is 0.35 acres. Of the
25 properties in the strip, 11 or 44% are equiva
lent or smaller than either Lot 21 or 22.
MINUTES OP THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 6
#874 DUANE BARTH & MRS. JOHNSTONE . . , .
The total acreage of this area divided by the no.
of houses yields an average lot size is 0.48 acres.
In past applications the precedent for this type of
application has been set. Would this application
be a precedent for smaller lots?
Sime questioned whether the Planning Commission
could approve this aplication because of the
following facts: the lot was there first and it
was approved, it has been in single ownership, they
have done nothing to alter what was a buildable lot
and it would seem that they are grandfathered in.
Don Peterson stated that there are 7 - 60' lots to
the north and of the 7 the Johnstone lots are the
largest. The Johnstone lots meet the hardcover
standards where some of the other lots don't. I
think this proposal fits in well with the neighbor
hood .
Dave Kiss asked if a variance would be needed to
put a house on Lot 21.
Simo stated that this is the whole point. These
are two individual lots, always have been. This is
how the tax assessor has treated it.
Goetten's concerns were that 10 to 15 lots within
the zoning district could come in and ask for a
buiIding permit.
Rovegno asked if both lots had been homesteaded.
It was clatified that only the lot with the house
had been. He then asked if it is possible to get a
tax refund based on the fact that the lots have
been treated as one lot.
Sime clarified that a person can file for a refund
for three years prior.
Gaffron stated that the difference being these are
legally combined lots for tax purposes and it
becomes a subdivision through our ordinances vs two
separate lots - no subdivision is needed to sell
the property.
Sime moved, Rovegno seconded, to recommend approval
of Lot 21 as a separate building site based upon
the following findings:
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MINUTES OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 7
«874 DUANE BARTH & MRS. JOHNSTONE
1. The proposal can meet all hardcover require
ments of the LR-IC Zoning District.
2. Al] setback requirements for the new lot can be
met.
3. From the tax record it appears that the lot has
been valued and assessed as a separate lot, not
incrementally as part of the adjacent property.
4. The applicant has owned the property since
before the current zoning went into effect.
5. The property has been assessed for sewer.
6. The lot area is consistent with many other
properties in the neighborhood and is equivalent to
or larger than 11 of 25 lots in the neighborhood.
Conditions for granting approval;
1. Granting a variance to the setbacks for the
existing house.
2. No other performance standard setbacks allowed
for either lot i.e. both must meet all hardcover
and setback requirements.
3. $225 plant charge to be paid with building
poermit along with standard SAC charges, etc.
4. Removal of existing garage on Lot 21.
5. the applicant to bear tlie expense of bringing
sewer to the property if no stub exists.
Adams stated he is in oposition of this motion
because we would be creating a substandard side
yard setback on Lot 22 by allowing Lot 21 to built
on. The fact the Lot 21 has a garage on it and Lot
22 has a house on it suggests that for many years
the owner of this property has used it as one lot.
Mad they had both the house and garage on one lot
that would indicate the intention of selling the
adjoining lot at a later time. But I see this
property as one that has been used as a single
piece of property for all intents and purposes and
for that reason I am oppossed to this motion.
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minutes of the planning commission meeting held NOVEMBER 19, 1994 PAGE 8
#874 BARTH/JOHNSTONE Rovegno questioned Adam's opposition, referring to
a similiar situation in which a larger piece of
land would be subdivided with a house on one lot
and a garage serving that house on another. Would
you disallow that subdivision?
McDonald agreed with Adams stating that we have got
to be strict in this matter to protect Lake
Minnetonka.
Motion, Ayes (1), Nays (5).
McDonald moved, Adams seconded, to recommend denial
subject to the following findings:
1. The lots were used as one property, house on
one lot and garage serving house on the other lot
thus indicating that they had planned to use it as
one homosite.
2. There is no sewer stub and plant charge has not
been paid.
3. The lot areas proposed are significantly less
than the average lot area in the neighborhood.
4. This could set a precedence in that 10 to 15 new
building sites might have to be allowed to be
created from existing common substandard ownership
lots if this is approved in this zoning district.
5. A side yard setback variance for the existing
house would have been necessary.
Motion, Aye (5), Nay (1).
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MINUTES OP THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 9
«876 RANDY ASPLUND,
3424 t 3444 EASTLAKB STREET
VARIANCE
PUBLIC HEARING
Chairperson Goetten announced that #876, Randy
Asplunds application for a variance has been tabled
until the next meeting of the Planning Commission.
The following neighbors were present for the
meeting;
Harriet Hehl of 3348 Bayside Road
Esther Addison of 3382 Bayside Road
Barbara Huber of 3390 Bayside Road
Kathe Jukish of 3280 Bayside road
Don Boylan of 3240 Bayside Road
Rovegno moved, Kelle'y seconded to table the
application.
Motion, ayes (6), Nays (0).
«878 THOMAS KAUL
INTERPRETATION OP ZONING CODE
PUBLIC HEARING
9:45 - 9:49
Thomas and Kristi Haul were present. Zoning
Administrator Mabusth noted the certificate of
mailing and the affidavit of publication. The
following neighbors were present for the public
hearing :
Mary Ann Stinson of 2040 Spates Avenue
A.J. Tourangeau of 2060 spates Avenue
Pauline Bouchard of 1860 Shoreline Drive
Ronald J. Prineas of 1980 Heritage Drive
Mabusth asked if any of the members of the Planning
Commission were able to attend the open house given
by the Hauls at 1900 Shoreline Drive. Goetten
hadn't received her invitation. Rovegno said he
had tried unsuccessfully to reach Goetten. Sime
and McDonald were unable to attend.
minutes of the planning commission meeting held NOVi^ER 19, 1984 PAGE 10
#878 THOMAS HAUL GoGtten wanted to note that she had received a ca 11
from Kathy Coward, owner of 1950 Heritage Drive,
now residing in NY. Mrs. Bouchard introduced a
copy of Kathy Coward's letter which Chairperson
Gnrtten read to the people present. (See attached
letter.)
Mrs. Bouchard presented another letter representing
tpo Fox Hill Association which Chairperson Goetten
also read. (See attached letter.)
Mabusth commented on the phone call she recieved
from Mr. Stinson regarding the application.
Mabusth reported on his position. Mr. & Mrs.
Stinson have a rental unit in the Virgin ■‘^’ands
and they would not like to see this type of
activity in this neighborhood.
Goetten read the letter written by Pauline Bouchard
to Jean Mabusth. (See attached letter.)
Kristi Kaul asked to state her feelings. She
realizes that there is a lot of opposit'on and
teels that the neighbors have a predeterjr.ined
notions C‘ what a Bed and Breakfast (hereafter
referred to as a B&B) would be like elsewhere.
What we really want to do is first and foremost
is have this as our home. We would have very
limited house guests coming and staying, mainly
3ust on week-ends. Our main objective is to
restore the house to its original state and
maintain it. We have contacted all of the neighbors
and informed them of our plans. We feel that the
way the house is located and because of the
existing vegetation, the extra guests that would be
staying, wouldn't even be noticed. There are seven
bedrooms but only four rooms would be available for
guests. We feel that the history of the area is so
valuable to maintain. So much of it has been lost.
We are looking at our .home - not a business.
McDonald stated she felt that what the neighbors
were trying to say is that people are people and it
is hard to control their actions.
MINUTES OP THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 11
1878 THOMAS KAUL Kaul stated that she and her husband had visited
the other B&B's in the area and that they are
listed through the B&B directory which limits the
amount of traffic through your home. There are 40
homes in Minnesota. One example that is similiar
to what we are trying to do is on Mount Curve
Place. It is in a residential area and the house
doesn't look any different than any of the others
in the area. My suggestion is to have a represen
tative of the neighborhood and of the Planning
Commission come with us to talk to these people and
their neighbors.
Kaul asked about a CUP permit.
Goetten stated they would then have to make some
changes in the zoning code. It is not considered a
conditional use at this time. Goetten suggested
that the issue of a B&B may have to oe looked into
and possibly amend the code to include a B&B.
Rovegno asked Mabusth if the residential area is
not the place for a BSB, which zoning area could
accommodate such a facility?
Goetten stated this a question of interpretation of
the home occupation code.
S..me referred to code book under 10.20 section 4(c)
for a home occupation only three (3) parking spaces
are accepted and the occupation cannot be visable
from the outside of the home.
Mabusth noted that tnis applied only to
professional people such as doctors, architects,
etc. who used their homos on a temporaly bases.
McDonald asked the Kauls if they had considered
any other homes in this area for their B&B.
Kaul said they had but they thought this was the
best area because of the location on a major
street. There would be no conflict of a private
street where a few extra cars on a given night
would bo noticed. We had considered the Pierce-
Wyer House in Excelsior but the size of the house
would tend to be more corimercial than we want since
this is to be our home.
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MINUTES OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOV0IBER 19, 1984 PAGE 12
1878 THOMAS KADL Adams commented that he thought this is a marvelous
idea and that it would be good for the community
but he felt that the neighbors views should be
heard.
Rovegno commented that he did remember the
application for the subdivision on this property
and the court findings. He felt that this is a
prime example of the houses of the erra and felt it
would be a good use of the land. He has known the
Hauls for several years and finds them to be a
hardworking, honest couple and feels they will
comply with the limitations set forth. He did,
however state that he is uncomfortable with the
"home occupation use".
Goetten stated B&B's are something that we should
address elsewhere because of the neighborhood
reactions. She recommended that staff look into
possibly amending the code to cover B&B operations.
Kelley moved, Sime seconded, recommendation for
denial of #878 Thomas Haul, 1900 Shoreline Drive,
subject to the following finding:
1. That a B&B does not meet the original intent of
the home occupation code Section 10.20,
Subdivisions 4 (C).
Motion, Aye (5), Nay (1).
Rovegno voted nay.
Minority Opion - Rovegno stated that under Section
10.20, Subdivision 4 (C) home occupations code, he
felt that B&B is accessory to residential use based
on review of performance standards provided by
staff. It is only carried on by persons residing
in the residence, there are no paid employees, the
use is conducted within the principal residence,
there no visible signs of use from the street, no
accessive stock stored on the premises, no
overcounter sales, the entrance is through the
principal residence and the septic system is up to
the B&B as well as the 8-10 member family that
could live there. I find the three (3) stall
f)arking not applicable because it only pertains to
profession practice. Further I find that County
Road 15 is a major throghfare and probably a suita
ble residential road on which to place such home
occupation. And the applicants appear to be
willing to subject themselves to
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MINUTBSOP THEPLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19,1984PAGE 13
1878 THOMAS RAUL further regulations beyond those provided for the
zoning code. I find that this is a home occupation
that doesn't require application to the Planning
Commission or City Council.
McDonald added that the home occupations code
should state that hotels and boarding houses not be
included in the code.
Kelley moved, Rovegno se'-'mA' ecommendation to
staff to review the planp’*-i ..nces to find the
appropriate sections tha«. •• vuld be amended and
reviewed by the PC and City Council for B&B's
within the City of Orono.
Adams commented that he believes there is a place
in Orono for B&B's and this is a oversite in the
code. Is a 100% in favor of the motion.
Motion, Ayes (6), Nay (0).
f880 STEVEN RUCE
4625 WEST BRANCH ROAD
CONDITIONAL USB PERMIT
PUBLIC HEARING
8:00 - 8:06 PM
Steven & Joyce Ruce were present. Zoning Adminis
trator Mabusth noted the certificate of mailing
and the affidavit of publication. There was no one
present from the public.
Ruce is requesting to build a greenhouse 10 x 25 in
the rear of the property attached to the house.
Gaffron stated that it does meet all setback
requirements and doesn't affect the septic system.
There is a deck in the back of the house. The
question arises because Mr. Ruce has some commer
cial dealings outside the home.
Ruce explained that ho is a gardener and works in
other peoples gardens. In the spring of the year
he grows plants to use in their gardens, which is
the purpose of the greenhouse. There is no walk-in
traffic.
Ruce also stated that the deck would be removed so
the greenhouse may be built. This would not
include the deck on the east side of the house.
Gaffron noted that there are no hardcover problems.
MINUTES OP THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19^ 1984 PAGE 14
1880 STEVEN RUCE McDonald clarified that the CUP goes with the
property if the house is sold but Council can ask
to have it reviewed.
Mabusth stated that there is no need to put on a
review policy of once a year because of the boiler
plate language used in the resolution.
Rovengno questioned the fact that it was considered
as a commercial greenhouse because it is not large
enough/ there are no people or vehicles coming in.
Rovegno stated he would like to have a
recommendation that they overrule staff/ because a
X 25* attached greenhouse used to grow plants
not for sale on the premises should not
considered on a size basis to require a CUP.
Kelley moved/ Rovegno seconded/ to recommend appro
val of #880 Steven Ruce, with the condition that
the structure conform to all pertinent Building
Code requirements and also to recommend to the City
Council to review the posibility of refunding
$150.00 filing fee based on the finding that there
is no retail sales activity taking place on the
property.
McDonald questioned the use of trucks and Ruce
clarified that he only had two pick-up trucks that
would be used.
Motion, Ayes (6), Nays (0).
minutes of the planning commission meeting held NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 15
#881 KRUTZIG CUSTOM HOMES, INC.,
1629 BOHNS POINT ROAD
VARIANCE
PUBLIC HEARING
9:43 ~ 10:30 PM
Bill Krutzig was present. Assistant Zoning
Aflmini strator Gaffron noted the certificate of
mailing and the affidavit of publication. The
following neighbors wore present for the public
hearing :
Douglas and Ceil I.ohmar of 1635 Bohn's Point Road
Mr. Iiohniar stated he was concerned with the
drainage along his let line and that Krutzig's lot
is a low lot and has accepted drainage from the
hills. Lohmar noted that Krutzig will be filling
in quite a large area which will affect the other
properties, and I would like to see a study done to
see if the very narrow strip remaining will take
care of the drainage. If the drainage can be taken
care of, he would have no concern. He stated that
he had specifically sloped his existing driveway to
take care of the drainage problem.
Mrs. Lohmar observed that within the last 10 years
she hasn't been able to walk across Krutzig's lot
because of the water level.
Gaffron stated that this lot is not a designated
wetlands.
Krutzig stated tnat there wi 1 1 not be a basement in
the house. He had consulted with *-he neighbors and
had come to the conclusion that a two story home
would bo disproportioned to the other homes in the
area .
Gaffron stated that the original application came
in requesting the house as shown, the decks, and
the driveway of indeterminate proportions and some
hardcover in the courtyard area. The proposed
house without the decks and additional hardcover
and with a bare minimum driveway meets the 25%
hardcover. Another consideration is the lot behind
the 250' point zone is quite substaricial and we
have in a number of other applications considered
giving the applicant credit for that area in
calculating hardcover.
MINUTES OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 16
1881 KRUTZIG HOMES GoGtten stated that one way we protect drainage is
to limit hardcover, and that the 250'-500' credit
has only been used for existing situations, not for
new lots for new construction.
Rovegno stated that the property must accept the
drainage that it has formally taken and not
discharge at a faster rate or direct it other than
the direction it has gone. That is a building
matter.
Lohmar questioned Krutzig about the fact that this
is a "spec" house. What are they going to do?
What kind of guarantee will be provided?
Krutzig noted that the certificate of occupancy
given by the City will be the guarantee because
before it is issued everything is inspected by the
building department.
Gaffron noted that the grading will have to be done
in a way that the water will flow onto the property
in the past way. Also, you may be creating more of
a problem by putting a house on this lot than was
there before even if you stay behind the 930'
elevation line.
Kelley stated he would have a hard time approving a
variance for hardcover since there is such a
problem with water right now.
Krutzig said he wasn't aware of a hardcover problem
until after the permit application was made.
Mabrsth had talked to the applicant prior to going
to Council and suggested building a 2 story house
or nuilding rather than out and reducing some of
the hardcover because Council does not look
favorably upon hardcover, variances.
Gaffron noted that Krutzig was told before the
permit was issued that we can't approve it with the
decks and the extensive driveway. That was his risk
to construct pilings before the additional requests
were approved.
McDonald questioned Krutzig about ever building a
house in Orono before. He has but stated he was
unaware of the hardcover stipulations until now.
4
MINUTES OP THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 17
1881 KRUTZIG HOMES Lohmar brought up another point about the lot.
Their sewer line is directly under the rear of
Krutzig's house, however, the house is on pilings
so that is not a problem. Lohmar stated that he
would like Krutzig to assured him that an easement
showing exactly where the pipj^ is and a right to
access his property will be drawn up.
Gaffron stated our sewer responsiblity ends at the
City's sewer manhole in the street. This is a
private easement serving these houses. We don't
have any code standards ttiat require sewer pipes to
be a certain distance from the house and this is a
case that we wouldn't allow today. But at this
time we have no responsiblity.
Krutzig explained that Gordon Coffin had gone out
and described this easement and we intend to
describe it by Metes & Bounds on an easement and
put it on fo a drawing. A formal written document
protecting the neighbors will have to drawn up by
Krutzig's attorney.
Gaffron stated that another issue is where will
Krutzig's house hook up to sewer? There is some
question as to whether the existing shared line can
handle another hookup. But this is considered a
building issue. One option they have is to move
the sewer lines but this is between the private
parties.
Rovegno moved, Kelley seconded, to recommend
denial of application #881, Krutzig Homes, 1629
Bohn's Point Road, based on to the following
findings;
1. At the time of application, the applicant was
informed by staff fully of the hardcover
limitations within the 75 - 250' zone.
2. This is a substandard lot in area and slightly
substandard on lot width.
3. It is a low lot that provides hydraulic
capacity for the drainage of adjoining properties
and the building department should address that
issue.
4. An adequate house ror this lot could have been
constructed, meeting the 4595 sq. feet of allowed
hardcover.
MINUTES OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 18
1881 RRUTZIG HOMES 5. That the additional hardcover is not necessary,
to maintain a substantial property right.
6. This problem of hardcover was brought on by the
applicant.
Krutzig clarified that he was not aware of
hardcover, he had his plans done according to the
setbacks, structural engineer had worked on the
plans, and all those plans had to be submitted at
one time. At the time they were submitted was the
time that Gaffron called and said we have a
hardcover problem. Krutzig stated that he had at
that time already spent $7500. He stated he had
the option to drop his plans or continue on the
basis that he apply for hardcover variance.
Krutzig also asked if a pool is considered
hardcover.
Rovegno clarified that a poo 1 is not considered
hardcover, the deck is but the pool has its own
closed recirculating movment. It doesn't drain, it
collects.
Motion, Aye (6), Nay (0).
FENCE ORDINANCE AMENDMENT
Mabusth clarified that she would like the input
sheets back to her by December 10, 1984.
,lv^
Rovegno questioned how long grading has to sit
there before it becomes existing grade? I feel if
we have a reference point that you know wi 1 1 be
consistent and then setting a height from that
point.
Rovegno feels that the fence issue should be
addressed as a total case including commercial and
residentia 1.
Mabusth noted that Council asked that only the
residential fence ordinance be looked at. They
also asked that controls bo considered for privacy
fences that are constructed as accessory
structures. Another issue is protecting the view
of neighbors. All of the sample codes submitted
for this review deal with protection of adjoining
property not protection for the person on the other
side of a major thoroughfare.
MINUTES OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING HELD NOVEMBER 19, 1984 PAGE 19
PENCE ORDINANCE Rovegno stated that we need some kind of
performance standard.
Kelley asked how wo project the image that we would
perfer natural plantings opposed to fences?
Mabusth noted that we can do this by encouraging
natural plantings through staff input and if not
effective require that person to file a variance.
r Rovegno stated that he would like to have all the
compiled input back by January 10, 1985 so there is
time to study the comments before the joint meeting
on Feburary 4, 1985.
APPROVL OP MINUTES
Sime move, Goetten seconded, to approve the
Planning Commission iiiinutes of October 22, 1984
subject to the changes noted by Rovegno.
Motion, I'ycs (6), Nay (0).
REPRESENTATIVE TO ATTEND
COUNCIL MEETING
ADJOURNMENT 10:45 PM
Sime volunteered to attend the Council meeting of
December 10, 1984.
Sime moved, Rovegno seconded, to adjourn the
regular Planning Commission meeting at 10:45 p.m.
Motion, Ayes (6), Nay (0).
4