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HomeMy WebLinkAbout09-04-2001 Park Commission Minutes MINUTES OF THE ORONO PARKS, OPEN SPACE AND TRAILS COMMISSION MEETING Tuesday,September 4,2001 1. ROLL The Park Commission met on the above-mentioned date with the following members present: Chair Andrew McDermott, Commissioners Debora Halvorson,Rick Meyers, Sherokee Ilse, Irene Silber, J. Patrick Wolfe, and Pauline Bouchard. Representing Staff was Lin Vee, Recording Secretary. Public Works Director Greg Gappa was absent. Chair McDermott called the meeting to order at 7:19 p.m. 2. APPROVAL OF AUGUST 6,2001 MINUTES This item was tabled to the October meeting. 3. AUGUST COUNCIL MEETINGS McDermott indicated he will give his report on the August 13th Council meeting under Item#9. Meyers stated he attended the August 27�"Council meeting where the Navarre Park grand opening was discussed along with designating the lake access points as neighborhood accesses. 4. PUBLIC COMMENTS Public comments were taken under Item No. 7. REPORTS/UPDATES: 5. NAVARRE PARK Meyers stated he would have the letters forwarded to Gappa. McDermott noted the City has not received a response back from the MS Society concerning their request for a financial contribution. Meyers stated the park dedication was included as part of the"Dog Days of Summer Celebration" in Navarre, and was well attended by approximately 150 to 200 local residents and young children. Meyers stated prizes were awarded to each child that attended the dedication along with face painting, balloons, and ice cream. Meyers expressed his thanks to the various businesses and individuals who donated the items for the event. 6. PARK DEDICATION FUND McDermott reported the Park Commission has spent approximately$116,000 on the improvements to the Navarre Park since 1999, with the majority being spent on the playground equipment and bringing City water to the park. McDermott stated the Park Fund can expect to receive approximately$32,000 from new construction this year,which is lower than what was originally anticipated. PAGE 1 MINUTES OF THE ORONO PARKS,OPEN SPACE AND TRAILS COMMISSION MEETING Tuesday, September 4,2001 The Park Commission reviewed the revenues and expenditures from the Park Fund, noting that approximately$118,000 was allocated towards the purchase of some park land at 3770 Shoreline Drive, with a$120,000 loan needing to be repaid for the purchase of another parcel of property. Meyers noted the Park Fund would be receiving some funds from the Golf Tournament being sponsored by the Narrows Saloon. Wolfe noted the Park Fund currently is approximatety$38,000 in the negative, with a$5,000 contribution being anticipated from the City's General Fund. McDermott stated the park dedication fees have been decreasing over the past several years due to the limited amount of new development that has occurred within the City. McDermott indicated that the amount of new development is not expected to increase significantly in the next few years. McDermott recommended Ilse address the Council at their next meeting on the status of the Park Fund and the anticipated decrease in park dedication fees over the next few years. 7. 39 LAKE ACCESS POINTS McDermott stated the Council would like the Park Commission to identify how the classifications were arrived at for the first 14 lake access sites and the criteria for classifying each access point. Lydiard Beach McDermott stated Lydiard Beach is one of the 14 lake access points that has been selected to be surveyed this year. Lydiard Beach has been an actively used swimming beach for at least the past 14 years, with a 66 foot platted road. McDermott indicated Lydiard Beach was classified as a Class IV swimming beach since it has been used as a swimming beach for a number of years. Sandy Beach McDermott stated as it relates to Sandy Beach,this lake access point has also been used as a swimming beach for at least 14 or 15 years, with signage having been erected denoting it as a park beach. Sandy Beach has been classified as a Class N swimming beach,with no fishing being allowed at swimming beaches. Stubbs Bay Ilse stated Stubbs Bay Fishing Pier has existed for at least 20 years, with a dock having been installed at this location approximately 12 to 15 years ago. The Park Commission classified Stubbs Bay Fishing Pier as a Class I and a Class II based on the historical use of this site. It was noted snowmobilers have used this area for many years to gain access to the lake. PAGE 2 MINUTES OF THE ORONO PARKS,OPEN SPACE AND TRAILS COMMISSION MEETING Tuesday, September 4,2001 Carman Street McDermott stated this access point was classified as a Class I, which allows fishing, pedestrian access to the lake, canoes and other small boats. McDermott noted a fishing pier has been located at this site for many years. Casco Point Beach Wolfe indicated this has been used as a beach for at least 20 years. The Park Commission classified this site as a Class N swimming beach. Loma Linda McDermott stated this access point has had a fishing dock on it for a number of years, along with winter lake access being available at this site. McDermott noted the Park Commission had classified this as a Class I and a Class III. Park Lane Ilse stated Park Lane has had a fishing dock, canoe/boat launch for the past 16 to 17 years. Ilse noted people do swim at this location although it has not been formally classified as a swimming beach. McDermott stated there could be some safety issues if people are swimming while people are fishing, and recommended that it not be classified as a swimming beach. McDermott stated the City has not had any sand hauled in or buoys erected to make it a formal swimming beach. The Park Commission classified Park Lane as a Class I and Class IIi, with the Class IV classification being removed. East Lake Street McDermott stated this is for winter access only, with a gate that is opened for snowmobile use during the wintertime for a number of years. The Park Commission classified East Lake Street as a Class III-A. North Shore Drive at Baldur Park Road McDermott indicated this access point may have been incorrectly classified. Bouchard stated this lake access point is similar to Spates Avenue and should have the same signage. Bouchard stated there is a gate at this location. McDermott stated historically this access point has been open to snowmobilers during the winter, with some fishing during the summer. The Park Commission classified this as a Class I and a Class III-A. PAGE 3 MINUTES OF THE ORONO PARKS, OPEN SPACE AND TRAILS COMMISSION MEETING Tuesday,September 4,2001 Rest Point Road McDermott stated this is an eight foot wide grassy strip to the lakeshore located on a cul-de-sac on Rest Point Road. This site has historically been used for snowmobile access and fishing during the summer. The Park Commission classified this as a Class I and a Class II. Rest Point Lane McDermott stated Rest Point Lane is a 33 foot platted corridor, with the road being located approximately 30 feet fram the shoreline. This access point does contain a sandy lakeshore and has easy access from the road.. One of the neighbors in this area has requested that the area be opened as a swimming beach. McDermott stated there is not a swimming beach presently in this area Bouchard indicated she is not willing to change the classification based on one neighbor's request. Gail Blackstone, 4465 Forest Lake, indicated her mother and sister live on Rest Point Road, and to her knowledge they are not aware of the proposal to change this to a swimming beach. McDermott stated this site could be one where the use is changing, which would necessitate the need for a public hearing. McDermott indicated public hearings would not be held on the other access points discussed tonight since the use has not changed. McDermott noted the City has not maintained this as a swimming beach in the past. Casco Circle McDermott noted this access point has historically been used for fishing, launching canoes, and pedestrian access to the lake. McDermott indicated it is not the intention of the Park Commission to change the use of this access point. The Park Commission classified this as a Class I. Ivy Lane McDermott stated the historical use of Ivy Lane has been for snowmobile access. This is a 60 foot wide platted road to the shoreline. McDermott noted this has been classified as a Class II and a Class V, which appears to be incorrect. The Park Commission classified Ivy Lane as a Class II. Forest Lake Landing McDermott stated Forest Lake Landing has been classified as a Class I. At a previous meeting the Park Cornmission had classified this site as a Class I, which is pedestrian access, fishing from the shore, launching of canoes and other small boats not requiring trailers. Since that time the neighbors have met with the Council and they are proposing a natural area designation for this access point. PAGE 4 MINUTES OF THE ORONO PARKS,OPEN SPACE AND TRAILS COMMISSION MEETING Tuesday,September 4,2001 McDermott stated public comments will be taken at this time regarding this access point. Tim Lembke, 4445 Forest Lake Landing, indicated he has lived at this address for the past seven years, and summarized his letter submitted to the City requesting that this area be given a Class I-A classification. Lembke stated the neighbors in this area do not want any additional signs,traffic, or parking on the street. Lembke stated he did recently go swimming at this area and found it to be rather polluted and dangerous to swim. Lembke stated the situation would be made worse without buoys, proper supervision and lack of sand. Lembke stated he has drafted a resolution for the City Council requesting this access point be given a Class I-A designation. McDermott noted some of the residents in this area had requested early on in this process that this access point be opened for swimming. McDermott stated this access point has been ruled out for swimming following Council Member Sansevere's review of the area and determination by the Council that this site was not appropriate for a swimming beach. The Park Commission had considered the option of opening this access point and Rest Point for swimming since there were no other beaches within the immediate area. Meyers inquired whether Lembke envisioned this area as having plantings all the way down to the shoreline to prevent people from walking down to the lakeshore. Meyers stated it is the goal of the City to better maintain these access points. Lembke stated it appears to be the desire of the people in the area to limit access to this site. Bouchard stated she understands the desire of the residents to limit the public's access to this site or discourage this area from becoming widely used. Bouchard stated as a public official she would have a difficult time agreeing to limit who can access this site when it is public land. Lembke stated the Park Commission does have a Class V designation, which is for drainage only, and could be utilized in this case. Lembke stated since this issue has arisen, he has not observed this access point being used. Tim Line, 4415 Forest Lake Landing, stated in his view the neighbors have come up with an acceptable solution to this issue. Line stated while this issue has brought the neighborhood together, it has also created some anxiety. Line indicated he is not"hung up"on restricting this access point to neighbors and guests, and feel the solution proposed is acceptable. Line stated he and his wife along with the Mullins would be willing to help maintain this access point. McDermott noted the City would also be involved in maintaining this access point. McDermott stated he did obtain some information from the DNR regarding an ecosystem approach to developing the shareline, which is similar to what the Lines are proposing. McDermott indicated the information recommends that the shoreline be turned into cattails and vegetative matter, not rip rap or rocks. McDermott noted Lili McMillan, with the LMCD, did hold a workshop recently on how lakeshores should be properly maintained,with emphasis being placed on vegetative plantings rather than rip rap. Meyers indicated the sites classified as Class V tend to be drainage and are basically inaccessible at this time to pedestrians. PAGE 5 MINUTES OF THE ORONO PARKS,OPEN SPACE AND TRAILS COMMISSION MEETING Tuesday,September 4,2001 McDermott noted the City Council has not yet formally approved any of the classifications given to the lake access sites. Patricia Affeldt,4765 Tonkaview Lane, stated she lives across the street from a parking lot so she understands the"not in my backyard" issue. Affeldt stated the traffic she has observed is from the neighbors in the area and not from other cities or other areas. Affeldt indicated there are some residents from this area and from Saga Hill who would like a beach they can walk to. Affeldt read a letter from Shirley Bull,4690 Tonkaview Lane, indicating her support and desire that this lake access point be restored. Affeldt commented that had she known this access point was available, she and her young children would have used it. McDermott pointed out that the property that encroaches into this access point is the Mullins' property and not the Lines. McDermott stated it creates a difficult situation since her residence is so close to the walkway. McDermott stated in his view the City is not willing at this time to vacate this access point. Lori Line, 4415 Forest Lake Landing, stated the walkway down to this access point is not located on their property, with Bull still having the misperception that the Lines have encroached into the City access. Line indicated all the work they have done in this area was done with the approval of the City. Line stated they feel this is a unique property given the situation with the Mullin property encroaching into the access point and that special consideration should be given to the City's other options. Line stated they are willing to cooperate with the City in turning this access site into a natural environment area. McDermott stated in the past the residents in this area may have been utilizing the wrong pathway down to the lake. Gail Blackstone,4465 Forest Lake, acknowledged the concerns of the residents of Tonkaview, noting that a large majority of the residents on Wildhurst, Forest Lake Landin, and Tonkaview are supportive of maintaining the natural area. Blackstone stated she would like to see the same concept that was used for the Saga Hill area applied to this site. Blackstone expressed safety concerns for any young children who may go down to the lakeshore unsupervised, noting this area is not visible from the street. Blackstone also pointed out that people interested in watching the sunset from this area would not be able to since it faces east. Blackstone inquired whether this area is still being considered for a swimming beach. McDermott stated the Council has recommended this area not be utilized for swimming. McDermott noted there would be a public hearing held at the Council level regarding the classification of the access points in the near future. Lembke inquired whether there weren't three access points on Forest Lake Landing. Ilse stated there are three inaccessible points. Ilse stated there is one on Elmwood, one on Vine, and one on Bluff Street, all of which are not very accessible at this time. Ilse stated this appears to be the most useable of the access points in this area. PAGE 6 MINUTES OF THE ORONO PARKS, OPEN SPACE AND TRAILS COMMISSION MEETING Tuesday, September 4,2001 McDermott noted the Park Commission had previously classified this access point as a Class I. McDermott stated following the past few meetings and the information recently obtained from the DNR, along with an offer by the Lines to help fund the restoration of this shoreline, the Park Commission may want to reconsider their classification of this site. Ilse stated in her view the Park Commission wants to be reasonable and compromise whenever appropriate to help protect the rights of the public. Ilse acknowledged that it is not possible to please everyone, but that the continuing concerns she has heard expressed throughout this process concern safety issues as it relates to swimming, safety issues as it relates to strange people in the neighborhood, and fishing problems. Ilse stated at this time vacating this access point is not an option for the City in light of the fact that there is no other good access for this part of the lake for non-lakeshore owners. Ilse stated she is a strong believer that all people should have the right to access the lake. Ilse suggested the following options be considered by the Park Commission: - Leave as is; - Accept the Lines' offer to turn into natural area; - Construct a stairway down to the lakeshore; - Erect no parking signs along Forest Lane to make it difficult for nonwalkers to access this site; - Erect no fishing signs at the water's edge to prevent fishing; - Erect signs that are low to the ground to keep this area more private; - Make a trade for another site to access the lake. Ilse stated in her view closing this access point and limiting it just to the neighbors is really not an option. Ilse reiterated that she feels strongly that access should be allowed and that swimming should be discouraged at this location. Ilse commented that steps can be taken to allow access by the local neighbors and not invite the entire general public to this lake access point. Wolfe stated in his view that is what the goal of the Park Commission is for all the lake access points. McDermott stated if this site is developed as a natural area, swimming would not be allowed. Ilse inquired if this area is turned into a natural area whether people would still be able to walk down to the lakeshore or just have a lookout area. McDermott stated that would be an item that would need to be discussed further. McDermott stated in his opinion if this area is turned into a natural area, one of the recommendations should be that individuals would still be allowed access to the bottom of the hill or be able to access a lookout area on the top of the hill, but that access into the water would not be an option. Meyers stated the idea of an overlook is an option that should be considered, but expressed a concern that the use of this access point would probably change if it is turned into a natural area. Meyers indicated he would like to see a diagram of what the natural area would look like prior to making this area natural. PAGE 7 MINUTES OF THE ORONO PARKS,OPEN SPACE AND TRAILS COMMISSION MEETING Tuesday, September 4,2001 McDermott concurred that the Park Commission would need a diagram of what the area would look like prior to turning this site into a natural area. McDermott stated in his opinion approximately 40 to 50 feet of the lakeshore would be restored,with the remaining 20 feet left as is. Wolfe agreed that this is an intriguing concept, but questioned whether this is beyond the scope of what the Park Commission has been directed to do. Wolfe stated in his opinion there might be better sites within the City for an ecosystem restoration and that the Park Commission needs to address what type of access should be allowed at this site. McDermott stated in his view if swimming is not allowed and there is just basically a pathway down to the lake,this access point will not become heavily used. Meyers questioned whether the Park Commission should even classify this as a Class I-A, noting that the exact language for this classification has not been finalized. McDermott stated the Park Commission needs to determine what type of classification they want to give to this site. McDermott indicated the Council would be holding a public hearing on this matter probably in September,with the Council voting on the recommended classifications. A Class I-A classification could include language that this is a natural area that is being developed for an ecosystem based approach for filtering drainage before it enters the water based upon the recommendations of the DNR. Ilse stated she has heard some of the residents say they are not opposed to having the neighbors have access at this time,with swimming not being recommended, and fishing not being preferred. Ilse stated perhaps the Park Commission needs to consider those types of issues first and what the City would like to see this access point used for. McDermott stated the first question in his opinion far the Park Commissio�� is whether they want to adopt a classification called a natural area. Bouchard indicated she would be willing to adopt a classification for a natural area, but that she would like to see pedestrian access left available. Meyers stated there could be an observation trail or lookout area constructed which would allow access close to the lakeshore. McDermott stated in his view the Park Commission is not in favor of fencing this access point off totally. Bouchard indicated she is not in favor of adopting a classification for a natural area if the public is not allowed to have access to it. McDermott and Meyers indicated they agree with Bouchard. Meyers stated if this area is turned into a natural area, swimming, boating, and fishing probably would not be allowed,which would be included in the classification language. Wolfe stated in his view adding the"natural classification"may be premature at this time. Wolfe stated people have been using this access point for the past 40 to 50 years, which cannot be PAGE 8 MINUTES OF THE ORONO PARKS,OPEN SPACE AND TRAILS COMMISSION MEETING Tuesday,September 4,2001 overlooked. Wolfe expressed concerns that in the future other groups will bring in other classifications that they would like adopted. Ilse commented it was her understanding that the Park Commission was discussing the concept of adopting a"natural classification" in general and not specifically to Forest Lake Landing. McDermott stated the discussion concerning a"natural classification" is general and that the Park Commission may want to revisit the sites classified as a Class V to determine whether they should be classified as a natural area also. McDermott noted the Council had directed the Park Commission to come up with a set of classifications for the various access points. Meyers stated in his view the topography of the area should dictate whether the area is classified as a natural area rather than politics. Meyers stated it would be up to the discretion of the Council whether they wish to change the classifications in the future depending on the changing circumstances of the area. McDermott moved,Meyers seconded,to create a Class VI,"Natural" Lakeshore Access Site,which would include naturalization of the shoreline for sites deemed appropriate for restoration to the natural habitat of the area, pedestrian access to the area,fishing from the shoreline,with boating not being allowed. Wolfe stated the Park Commission wants to encourage the local residents to develop the shorelines naturally. Meyers stated in his opinion if a resident comes up with an idea for a different classification, the Park Commission should consider it. Meyers stated in his view an additional classification of natural area with pedestrian access would be beneficial. VOTE: Ayes 3,Meyers,Bouchard,McDermott; Nays 4,Ilse,Silber,Wolfe,Halvorson. MOTION FAILED. llse indicated she would be willing to reconsider this classification in the future. (Recess was taken from 9:20 p.m.—9:30 p.m.) It was the consensus of the Park Commission to classify Forest Lake Landing as a Class I based upon the historical use of the site. Ilse noted the Park Commission did receive a request from some of the residents in this area for pedestrian access to the water. Ilse inquired where the markers would be placed at this particular site. McDermott stated it is his understanding the Park Commission had agreed to place the flush markers at the four corners of all lake access points, with discussion still to be had on where to place the upright markers at each particular site. The Park Commission had discussed at their previous meeting the option of placing some upright markers within the use area at some of the lake access sites. McDermott encouraged the members of the Park Commission to give some thought to a uniform method for placement of the upright markers. PAGE 9 MINUTES OF THE ORONO PARKS, OPEN SPACE AND TRAILS COMMISSION MEETING Tuesday, September 4,2001 Ilse stated she would not be opposed to providing a recommendation to the Council on the upright signs within a certain designated pathway, with the adjoining property owners being encouraged to continue to help maintain and naturalize the access points. Ilse stated due to the location of the Mullin residence and the row of arborvitaes that have been planted along the platted area, she would not be opposed to a 15 foot pathway being designated at the Farest Lake Landing. 8. ECOLOGICAL INVENTORY,ASSESSMENT AND RESTORATION PLAN Silber stated she has obtained some information regarding possible DNR grant opportunities, all of which require matching funds. Silber suggested either the Park Commission as a whole or as a subcommittee review the various grants available and determine which grants they would like to apply for. Silber noted the deadline is March 31St McDermott commented the City has not been properly maintaining its natural areas and needs to develop a plan for managing the natural areas. 9. FUND RAISING McDermott reported the City Council did not approve of the Park Fund receiving a portion of the profits from the pulltab operations within the City. The Council members in opposition of this revenue source indicated they did not want the money diverted away from the other youth organizations within the community, in particular the Mound Hockey Association, who expressed opposition to the proposal. Representatives from the Mound Hockey Association had indicated they have not yet recouped their initial $10,000 inveshnent. Ilse indicated some of the people in opposition to the City taking a portion of the funds cited the lack of notice by the City to do this. Ilse noted Orono players only comprise 6 percent of the Mound Hockey Association. Ilse moved, Silber seconded,to recommend to the City Council that they reconsider adopting a gambling ordinance effective upon renewal of the various organizations gambling license,with 10 percent of the profits being allocated to the Park Fund. VOTE: Ayes 7,Nays 0. Golf Tournament Meyers stated Jim Anderst,Narrows Saloon, approached him to see whether the Park Commission would be interested in receiving the profits generated from a golf tournament he is sponsoring. Anderst indicated he would like to make this an annual event and call it"Park&Ride Tournament",with the proceeds being donated to the Park Fund. Anderst stated he is anticipating $5,000 to $10,000 will be raised from the golf tournament this year. Newsletter Notice McDermott stated Council Member Nygard had approached him regarding the possibility of having a check-off box included on the utility bills soliciting donations to the Park Fund. The Council indicated they would not be in favor of that due to the amount of administrative work that would be PAGE 10 MINUTES OF THE ORONO PARKS,OPEN SPACE AND TRAILS COMMISSION MEETING Tuesday, September 4,2001 involved. The Council did agree to having a coupon of some sort included in the spring newsletter which the residents could tear out and mail in to the City with their donation. McDermott stated an article promoting the parks and past land donations would be included in the newsletter. Silber suggested a donation envelope be included within the newsletter. 10. CARLSON PARK McDermott stated Lili McMillan has approached the Watershed District regarding the holding pond proposed on this piece of property. The Watershed District is interested in reconstructing the wetland in this area, with possibly an overlook area, boardwalk or demonstration area also being constructed. McDermott stated McMillan indicated she would continue to work on this project with the Watershed District. 11. HACKBERRY PARK McDermott stated he will meet with Moorse and Gappa to determine whether there is any money available to do improvements at Hackberry. 12. FRENCH CREEK Halvorson read a draft of a letter proposed to be mailed to the area residents of the French Creek Preserve indicating the need to restrict dogs from this area in order to restore and preserve this natural nesting area. Halvorson recommended no dogs, even on leashes, be allowed in this area. Meyers recommended an article be included in the City's newsletter regarding dogs. It was the consensus of the Park Commission to have the letter mailed to the residents of the French Creek Preserve and to erect signage with the language Waterfowl Area—NO DOGS. COUNCIL MEETINGS September 10—Ilse Septrember 24—Halvorson ADJOURNMENT There being no further busin s� s th meeting was d' urned at 10:22 p.m. ✓ rew cDermott,Chair PAGE 11